Bolting down cockpit sole

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  • August 05, 2013 3:50 PM
    Message # 1359145
    Anonymous
    I've got a '76 W32 whose cockpit sole has never been bolted down in any way. I think it's a pretty standard setup...overlapping hatch riding on a narrow fiberglass lip, with cutaways for the scupper drains.

    Is there a clever, secure, but quick-release way to bolt the sole down? There are a few things in the engine room (e.g. two primary fuel filters, switchable in case one gums up) that I might want to get to in a hurry. Access from the cabin is pretty minimal. So I'm disinclined to just put in bolts with epoxied nuts on the lip side which would require wrenching to remove. I bet people here have come up with some clever solution. 

    Happy to also see a non quick-release setup that you're happy with. 
  • August 05, 2013 10:27 PM
    Reply # 1359349 on 1359145
    Deleted user

    The floor of the cockpit well should be bolted own. I also have been wondering if using silicone sealer as a glue would be sufficient, as it is exceedingly difficult to remove the floor panel. I made a cirular cut out and bolted a water proof manhole cover in it's place. This is an aluminum one as used on fishing boats. The advantage is  that when working on the engine in mid-ocean one does not get seasick from breathing the diesel fumes, and also to get to the engine, one does not have to enter the engine compartment from the inside of the cabin.

    I have to find some catalogs for fishing boat acessories as they are pretty common.

    Happy sails to you!

    Mike Zorn

  • August 06, 2013 1:09 PM
    Reply # 1360026 on 1359145
    For what it's worth... mine hasn't been bolted down for 20+ years. I have pad eyes on the bottom of the removable floor and pad eyes on the engine pan inboard of the fuel tanks with a tie strap to hold it down... when needed!
    I have never been in conditions bad enough to consider bolting it down!


  • August 07, 2013 9:57 AM
    Reply # 1360638 on 1359145
    We have put low profile square aluminum framed hatches in the after end of the cockpit sole with holdown latches that operate from either above or below.  Adding strips of teak to the top of the plex on the hatch strengthens it so the plex does not crack.

    Another trick is to use a crossbar under the cockpit floor, connected to carriage bolts on the cockpit floor with wing nuts to clamp down the crossbar.  Use a rubber or poly gasket around the hatch sealing surface.
  • August 07, 2013 10:13 AM
    Reply # 1360654 on 1359145

    I did something similar to Mike using a Bomar cast aluminum hatch.

    https://picasaweb.google.com/101274627576818259928/BomarMod#

    Last modified: August 08, 2013 6:03 PM | Anonymous member (Administrator)
  • August 07, 2013 10:51 AM
    Reply # 1360681 on 1359145
    Anonymous
    Those hatches are very nice but also very expensive!   Hope I run across one in a salvage joint too.
  • August 07, 2013 2:55 PM
    Reply # 1360872 on 1359145
    Deleted user

    I used a Bomar hatch like Harry mentioned. It come with a humangous allenwrench. The hatch is watertight and allows for easy removal and is big enough for a fat man to climb through. It is an aluminum casting and stiff enough to use only a crossbar to pull it down with the rubber seal in between. It would be nice to have a polycarbonate (Lexan etc) window in it for light, but I do not want to create problems where ther were none before.

    Mike

    Last modified: August 07, 2013 2:56 PM | Deleted user
  • August 07, 2013 6:55 PM
    Reply # 1360963 on 1359145

    And now for something completely different.

    My cockpit well deck/floor is has a full length SS piano hinge down the stbd side (fore & aft).  This allows me to simply swing the floor completely out of the way giving me full access to the engine compartment.  Although when opened it wedges pretty tight I also have a failsafe 'lanyard' thru the cockpit floor (knotted on the backside) just the right length with a loop on the end to loop over the jib sheet cleat. 

    On the opposite side I have two of these (cast brass) flush mount turning lock lift handle latches:

    http://www.greenboatstuff.com/abihatulolih.html

    You lift the handle, rotate 90 degrees and lift.

    Last modified: August 08, 2013 6:01 PM | Anonymous member (Administrator)
  • August 08, 2013 11:00 AM
    Reply # 1361340 on 1359145
    Antonio,

    I addressed this issue in a post entitled Engine Access Made Easier back in January 15, 2012. The photos were taken while the project was still under construction, but I have now had time to test it sufficiently.  I still feel it's an ideal solution.

    One of the previous owners had filled in the bolt holes that were once used to fasten the sole  to the cockpit base. For some reason, they also removed the flange that once overlapped the base. (That post also addresses this issue.) While there is perhaps no great need to fasten in the floor during fair-weather sailing. But what do you suspect might happen if your boat was knocked flat for some reason? Perhaps by a rogue wave, or being hit during a crossing a ship that was steaming without lights, or for any other possible reason? How long do you think it might take to to fill your boat with water if it rolled over, losing the floor and leaving a 3' x 4' hole in the cockpit? Yeah, it probably would never happen. But what if it did?

    My solution was to permanently affix 4 DeStaco clamps to the underside of the sole. These clamps are normally used as hold-down clamps for table saws, etc. I've used them for that purpose for years and they work great! Under normal circumstances, I might leave them unlocked, as my setup allows me to gain access to the engine room within 10 seconds for storing or removing various items (like folding bicycle, hookah dive compressor, etc.). But any time I plan to be in open water, it also takes me about 10 seconds to clamp all four of them good and tight. Besides... even with a gasket on the floor, a heavy rainfall in FL is enough to fill the well above the overlap of the sole and allow water to seep in. Clamping the four clamps negates this concern.

    At some point, I'll try to find time to create an article for Windblown. But for now, the previous post and the following photos should suffice to illustrate my solution.




    Photo showing how I easily remove the sole in a matter of seconds.
    Lines are attached temporarily and each is a different length to force the angle.
    (Old photo, before cockpit refinishing.)





    This shows the step inserted at the front of the well, so I can easily step in and out.
    The sub-floors also lift in and out and provide room for storage and make a
    comfortable seat while working on the engine. Normally, there is also a step that
    lays over the top of the transmission to give me a comfortable place to stand, without
    straddling the 45 degree angle of the hull or risk damaging the transmission cable.





    This shows the DeStaco clamps attached to the underside of the cockpit sole.
    It also shows the new flange that was added to replace the one that was removed.




    Close-ups of the corner of the new flange (upside down, of course).




    Close-up of the DeStaco clamps permanently mounted to the underside.



    Photo from inside the engine room (steps, looking aft) which shows the 
    sole in place, but with DeStaco clamps not yet clamped in place.




    This photo shows one of the clamps fastened down.


    Typically, I fasten the forward two clamps at all times, since I can reach them without any trouble. I need to remove the steps and lay on the engine to reach the two aft clamps, so I don't do that regularly. If it weren't for the fact that I now have such easy access to the engine compartment for storage, I'd go ahead and do all four each time. I have yet to see any engine room in a boat this size that provides easier access from all sides. And it literally takes seconds to do so. I'm just shy of 5' 10", but I've also had friends try it out who ranged from 5' 3" to 6' 4". They all found it to be just as easy to get in and out. I've seen some other good solutions, but I wouldn't trade for any of them!
  • August 08, 2013 4:36 PM
    Reply # 1361581 on 1359145
    Deleted user

    Jack, that is the best solution I have seen and it's the idea that I have been waiting for. The pervious owner installed a stainless frame on the cockpit well flange with nuts welded to them.  The floor is then bolted down with fourteen brass bolts with half round shaped washers to allow for misalignment. It's worked well for twenty years but is a little cumbersome to get to the engine and batteries which we do all the time.  I hope I can get it done before we leave this year.

    Jim

     

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