Splitting in Caprail

  • October 31, 2013 6:52 PM
    Message # 1425841
    Deleted user
    I am experiencing some splitting on my starboard caprail, nearly at the midships point. It's separating cleanly on the wood grain.  Any recommendations on a permanent repair that's more than just slapping on some decent wood glue and clamping it?  -Tom 
  • November 02, 2013 6:54 PM
    Reply # 1426732 on 1425841
    Info needed. How thick is the Teak? Has it been varnished or left raw most of it's life. Some people think Teak is forever. It's not. You could be in for a lot of maintenance work if you continue to chase these demons.  On the caprails good teak should not split without some encouragement. Did you drop something big and heavy on it?  If it's splitting from drying out for the last 40 years you would be best to begin planning on replacing it. If it is under 1/2" now you would be smart to plane on replacing it.

    If however it is good solid teak you can try the drill and plug route. You can actually maker larger plugs say up to an 1" and drill and plug. You could also drill and use a pattern bit in a router to make a key for the place. And picture would be nice to see actually how bad or big it is.  And if you can clamp and move the wood (depending on where the screws through the caprail are; you can pour in some thickened epoxy and clamp the sides to bring it back together. Me thinks that would only be a temporary fix and you would again be looking to replace the boards.

    And if you have good Teak and want it to last..... Varnish it and keep it varnished!

    Good Luck
  • November 03, 2013 1:37 PM
    Reply # 1427073 on 1425841
    Deleted user
    I appreciate the input.  First, the teak is natural, not varnished, in good condition other than the one split which is actually a diagonal separation from the outboard edge nearly midships, extending about six inches diagonally to about the midpoint (width) on the caprail.  It's about one inch thick and I can try the screw and bung to draw it in (also easy to clamp) and use epoxy or Gorilla glue to set it.   I'll let you know how it comes out.  -Tom
  • November 03, 2013 6:04 PM
    Reply # 1427183 on 1425841
    My 2 cents. If it all looks good and it is split then the wood is beginning to become too dry. After you repair it, use lots and lots of oil and then lots and lots of oil or seal it with varnish. Wood will not split without a reason, either too dry or stress. You can tell best which it is. It must be rather newish to be still one inch thick so you have a good chance of saving it all. Good luck
  • November 05, 2013 1:51 PM
    Reply # 1428469 on 1425841
    Tom,

    I would highly recommend NOT using Gorilla Glue! I used to be a very strong proponent of this product, but I have had far too many failures with it over the past two years of work on my boat.I think West System is a far superior option in every respect.

    My caprails were in horrible shape. I've seen yours. Trust me... there was NO comparison. I'd have traded mine for yours in a heartbeat.

    My caprail had been badly damaged through lack of care on behalf of the previous owner. It became even worse from spending 5 years in the Florida sun and humidity, while stored 2,500 miles from my place of residence in Denver.

    It was my intention to create a temporary patch that would allow me to waterproof the caprail, until such time that I could replace the entire rail.


    This photo shows the state of the damage when I fist began the repair. To say that I had problems with leaks would be an incredible understatement. By this time, the rail was cracking badly and had absorbed so much water it almost never dried.





    After picking out the rotted wood, I began the repair using a mixture of Gorilla Glue and teak sawdust. At the time, this seemed like a good approach. As it turned out, it wasn't such a great idea! The general consistency of the Gorilla Glue, made it very difficult to spread into the cracks and crevices. I hadn't considered how much Gorilla Glue expands when it dries. While this can be helpful when gluing/clamping two pieces together, it does not work as a filler!.




    t's somewhat difficult to tell in the photo, but the expansion of the glue resulted in a very pourous finish, upon sanding. While the glue might be waterproof, the repair would not have been. It was also rather ugly!




    This photo shows the repair as I picked out most of the Gorilla Glue/sawdust filler to start again.



    This time I used West System Epoxy, using #105 Resin, #207 Special Clear Hardener, and #405 Wood-Toned Filleting Blend. While the end result was not an exact match to the teak, it was close enough for a semi-temporary patch.




    After sanding the patch and applying the finish coats, the result looks good enough that I'll probably leave it for some time... maybe forever. To be honest, it came out much better than I had anticipated.





    The other really bad spot on the caprail was within the lamination at the stern of the boat. In this area, the teak had completely dry-rotted through to the inner joint and to the outer side. (I thought I had taken a photo of the top, before beginning the repair, but apparently I did not.) As in the first repair, I only intended to create a temporary patch that would stop further damage, until I could replace the teak all the way around.

    Although I did not take a photo of the rail top, this one shows the extent of the rot.




    As in the previous patch, I started with Gorilla Glue mixed with teak sawdust. As before, the resulting patch was far too pourous. (No... I'm not dense enought to make the exact same mistake twice. I took the same approach on both repaires, because both were done at the same time.)



    This photo shows the patch after removing the Gorilla Glue and then replacing it with West System. It was then sanded and ready for final finish. Again... it's not perfect, but fixed the problem and the concern for further rot.




    I had a few sections of the caprail in which large chunks had been removed. Apparently, the previous owner didn't believe in the use of fenders. Though fairly unsightly, I was able to make these patches using nothing but the West System Epoxy. As before, I made a thick paste from #105 Resin, #207 Special Clear Hardener, and #405 Wood-Toned Filleting Blend. This photo shows the epoxy, after hardening.



    This one shows the repair after rough shaping...



    And this photo shows the rail after final sanding and ready for finish coats. After the finish was applied, you can only find this and similar patches if you know exactly where to look for them!






    If you follow Dave's general suggestions as well, and do the work as well as you've done everything else, you should have no problems!


    Jack

  • November 05, 2013 7:10 PM
    Reply # 1428671 on 1425841
    Anonymous member (Administrator)

    Jack:

    Nice repair of the caprails - mind if I add to the FAQ section?

    Jay

  • November 06, 2013 3:51 AM
    Reply # 1428825 on 1425841
     Not at all, Jay. The post was put together rather hurriedly, since Tom was about to start his own project. Tom's cap rails are in MUCH better shape than mine were when I started the repairs.

    I would typically go back to clean up the post later. But since Tom and I had a 45 min phone call about the project just after putting it online, I left it like it was originally. If you'd like to copy it to the FAQ section, it would be nice if I could make some edits first. Perhaps Bud might like me to put it in the "Things that Fail" section of his WestsailParts.com web site.

    Jack
    Last modified: November 06, 2013 5:48 AM | Anonymous member
  • November 06, 2013 4:33 AM
    Reply # 1428842 on 1425841
    Deleted user
    Jack, 
        Nice job!  I'll second your recommendation on the epoxy method.  

    Mike
  • November 06, 2013 5:56 PM
    Reply # 1429442 on 1425841
    Anonymous member (Administrator)

    Jack:  I'll wait a while to copy your post - there is an edit link on the right of your post.

    Jay

  • November 08, 2013 8:31 AM
    Reply # 1430724 on 1425841
    Go ahead and do it whenever it's convenient, Jay. I'm so busy working on phase II of Bud's site right now that I probably won't have time to get to it.

    Since you'll be taking it out of context of the thread, it would probably be best to delete the first two paragraphs and start with "My caprail had been badly damaged through lack of care...".

    Thanks.
    Jack