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replace tiller with wheel?

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  • February 09, 2012 8:27 PM
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    Reply # 821317 on 819797
    Anonymous member

    The Beta 38, formerly called the Beta 1505, has the same power curve as the Perkins 4-108.  The Beta has plenty of power, including reserve power, to easily handle the 20,000 lb. Westsail 32. 

    The fiberglass deck on the W32 has had a teak overlay installed on many of them.  The teak can be removed, the holes filled, and a nonskid paint applied if you find a suitable boat with teak decks, and decide to remove them.
  • February 09, 2012 9:15 PM
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    Reply # 821335 on 819797
    Anonymous member
    Sam,

    Following is a link to a thread in the Forum archives on my site, Westsail.info, that was originally posted by Rich Morpurgo, regarding the project to which Bud refers. There are some good photos on this thread that should give you an idea of the work required.



    And this link is to an excellent website for Fluid Motion, a Westsail 32 that was then owned by Kevin Clements and Stephanie Los. (The site hasn't been updated since Aug, 2007 and Kevin and Stephanie have since sold the boat.) This particular job was done in 2006, when the old teak deck was removed and replaced with a new one. If you reference only the first half of the page, it also provides some good photos of the project before you, should you follow this route.



    I hope this helps in your decision.

    Jack Webb


  • February 10, 2012 6:50 AM
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    Reply # 821778 on 819797
    Deleted user

    Thanks Jack,  I would be up for a job like that. If I found a boat where the only draw back was the teak decks, and the price was right, I wouldn't let that keep me from buying it. I just don't want a project that will take months or a year. I can do just about anything at a professional level. My background is steel fabrication but am good at carpentry, plumbing, electrical, mechanic, anything that would be required of me regarding my boat. I don't know anything about sail making or sail repair, but I can learn. I wanted to buy my boat in Gulf of Mexico or the East Coast, sail the caribbean for a cople of seasons, keeping my boat in Rio Dulce, Guatemala, then go through the Canal and head for the South Pacific. But I'm seeing some W32's that have sparked my interest on the west coast. Might have a plan B, keep it in Mexico and sail the Sea of Cortez for a couple years, not sure. I'll probably buy the right boat wherever it is. A few questions: What is a good dinghy for the W32 and where would you keep it? Davits, solar panels, wind generator, space is limited at the stearn. I think fabricate something off the stearn to accommodate these. Also, what do you think the best GPS w/ chart plotter is? Good sextant? I want everybody to know that I appreciate all the help.    Sam

     
  • February 10, 2012 9:01 PM
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    Reply # 822372 on 821778
    Anonymous member
    Samuel Gray wrote:

    I would be up for a job like that....

    What is a good dinghy for the W32 and where would you keep it? Davits, solar panels, wind generator, space is limited at the stearn. I think fabricate something off the stearn to accommodate these. Also, what do you think the best GPS w/ chart plotter is? Good sextant? I want everybody to know that I appreciate all the help.    Sam


    Sam,

    It sounds like you have a Westsail in your future, Sam. The W32 is a great boat and will serve you well if you keep it in shape and it sounds as though you're up to the task. Good luck with your search for the right boat. It helps that you're open to location and other factors.

    Lots of good questions... many of which are probably suited for a thread of their own. Perhaps you might start another. I'll try answer them briefly, but understand this is just one man's opinion. Many of your questions are potential for heated debate.

    Dinghy: This would vary depending upon use. An inflatable is great for diving and general transportation, though not as durable as a hard dink. I do not advocate towing any dinghy except in relatively protected waters, and an inflatable can be stowed in the cockpit or below decks when in open water. A hard dinghy will hold up longer and can be stowed before or behind the mast, as appropriate. Anything stowed on deck, however, is at the mercy of heavy weather and also cumbersome to work around in such conditions. Read the opinions of several experienced cruisers, if this is your intended goal.

    Davits: I personally wouldn't subscribe to them for cruising... especially on a double-ender. Besides, there really isn't room for them with the boomkin and vane steering.

    Solar panels & wind generator: I think both are pretty much required for serious cruising. I have about 200 watts of solar, plus a Four Winds wind/tow generator, but there are many good options. Do make the vane steering a first priority if you intend to cruise, and then work the rest around it!

    Best GPS w/ chart plotter: Too big of a question for here and too many good options. Two good ones ones would likely be sufficient. Assuming you'll take a laptop aboard, make at least one of these a computer-based GPS application(s). Perhaps something like a Garmin hand-held would be a sufficient backup. All told, I have at least eight devices for GPS navigation aboard and at least 25 applications between them. (Yes, that's overkill.)

    Good Sextant: Again, many good options. Davis makes an excellent starter model out of plastic (Mark 3) that would probably serve you well. They are lightweight, corrosion-proof and affordable. My own sextant is a classic 1945 bronze model by C. Plath.

    Start some threads on these subjects and hopefully you'll get some good responses. Understand, however, that your feedback may be slow to come, as your audience is limited to those members who currently monitor the Forum and who will take the time to respond... it does take time to enter a worthwhile response, and most members are unlikely to keep answering the same questions that they've answered previously.

    You will find it useful to search the WOA archives on my site at http://Westsail.info. It contains the 8 years of forum archives that were removed last February, as well as all but the most recent threads from this forum. (I update it as I find time during my refit.) I have listed some various threads from the archives that you might find valuable. Do some searching on your own and I think you'll find a great deal more information than you are likely to get than by reposting all the questions at once on the current forum. There is an incredible amount of information buried in the Archives if you learn how to search it correctly... read the "Search Help". Notice that terms are often mis-spelled by posters, so take this into consideration when you search. The following are not searches, but specific threads I found for you. Do your own as well.

    Archived threads by thread name...

    These are just a few examples of what you'll find on Westsail.info forum archive, with it's 8 years worth of questions and answers. Do some of your own searches and you'll be amazed what's out there. Good luck in your search and, in advance, welcome to the Westsail family.

    Jack Webb

    Last modified: February 11, 2012 4:10 AM | Anonymous member
  • February 11, 2012 7:02 AM
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    Reply # 822594 on 819797
    Deleted user
    Thanks Jack   Yeah, I thought I was asking too many questions at once on this thread. I will search your site for the info I need and the other threads that you show on your post. I had a survey done on a W32 in Florida about 4 months ago, and although it seemed like a good price, based on what the guy told me, he had no photos, it just needs too much work. The surveyor took a lot of photos for me.Even if I did all the work myself, it would take a lot of time and money. I just don't have the time I would need to fix everything that was required. But one thing that this guy did that I thought was little a unusual is he built a boomkin, I guess that's what you would call it, off the back that is quite large with a shaft running vertically and had an out board engine mounted to it so that it would slide up and down on the shaft, to use in case his inboard diesel failed. Strange looking deal, but it did allow for room off the Stern to mount or store things. I'll try to post a photo of this thing. Thanks again.      Sam
  • February 11, 2012 8:10 AM
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    Reply # 822625 on 819797
    Anonymous member
    I would indeed like to see a photo of that, Sam... it does indeed sound unusual. You know, of course, that the W32 already has a boomkin by design. I won't comment on the logic for such a contraption, not having seen it. I would imagine, however, that it could possibly exert a great deal of stress on a critical structural member (the boomkin), especially in any kind of heavy weather. Perhaps it would be a better idea to keep the inboard diesel in proper running order, rather than rely on underpowered outboard when the inboard diesel fails. Presumably, should the diesel fail, one could always turn to sail-power, wouldn't you think?

    To emphasize the importance of maintaining the structural integrity of the boomkin, you might check out this link: Tom Corogan's Journey. (This link is to the 2nd page, with photo. You might want to read the entire post.) Hanging things like davits, etc., also potentially affect this integrity.

    You do see all kinds of strange modifications. I could mention a few that I've seen on this site (but I won't).

    Jack
  • February 13, 2012 7:51 AM
    Quote
    Reply # 824009 on 819797
    Anonymous member
    re: Dinghy & motor observations from a NW Caribbean (singlehanded live aboard) Cruiser:

    1. Your dinghy/motor is almost (if not ) as important as your 'big boat'.  It's how you get around 90% of the time once you get where you are going (feet being the other 10% :). It is your MAIN day to day transportation.  The analogy is the same as your house & car at home. Purchase accordingly.

    2. While rollups (high pressure floors, slatted floors, etc.) are fine for calmer waters and nice to stow my own experience is they just do not have the structural stability to deal with anything over a 2' chop.  Anything over that they tend to buck & twist and become 'worrisome'.  And with the normal 'trades' down here being 10, 15, 20 kn steady it's almost guaranteed you will be running in bigger waves. Didn't take me long to abandon my high pressure floor Zodiac and buy a Rigid Inflatable Boat (RIB).

    3. That said, avoid the 'fancy' RIB's with dual floors, integrated lockers/ice chests, molded seats, etc.. They are better suited for bigger boats with davits and otherwise just too heavy to get on/off deck.. While it may not have the  'wife pleasing' flat deck of a double floor dinghy a single floor dinghy is much lighter and easier to keep clean (every dual floor dinghy owner I know complains about water getting trapped between the decks and thus impairs the outboard ability to push the dinghy).

    4. I see very few 'hard' (rowing/sailing) dinghies.  Those I do see are used by  the more ummm... down & out cruisers or those that view rowing as an essential exercise regimen.  If you are dead set on a hard dinghy wait till you get there before buying.  You will usually find them for sale cheap (especially Walker Bays)

    The most popular RIB's is the Caribe brand.  However on a WS32 I find the oversized tubes on a Caribe (or ABI, etc.) make them too wide and take up too much deck space when stowed forward of the mast.  I think I've found (for me) the perfect RIB for a Westsail: a 9' Hypalon single floor Apex lightweight RIB (Apex A-9 Lite) . When I need to replace it I will buy another just like it.

    5. Forget PVC material (Zodiac, West Marine, etc.). Buy Hypalon. The sun down here is BRUTAL and eats PVC for lunch.  Even with Hypalon tubes I recommend finding someone that can fabricate you some dinghy 'chaps' to protect the dinghy from sun, chafing at the dinghy dock, etc..

    6. If at all possible wait until you get where you are going to buy your outboard (the 'When in Rome' crusiing strategy).  Virtually every outboard you see S. of the U.S. is a 2 cycle Yamaha Enduro with Suzuki starting to become fairly common lately as well. The Yamaha Enduro (no longer available in the states due to EPA regulations) is Yamaha's commercial outboard which means it's a 'heavy duty use', simple to repair motor with parts everywhere.. I can't tell you how many times I hear someone on the local net looking for some Mercury/Honda/Johnson/Evinrude part.

    7. Forget the 3-4hp 4 cycle motors.  Sure they are easier to stow but they just don't have enough 'oomph' to get you thru those times when the waves/weather kick up. I've been more 'scared' in my rollup dinghy with a 4hp Honda getting me nowhere while twisting and turning in some 3-4' chop than being in 15-20' seas on my W32. And jeeze... even in clam water it took me forever to get somewhere. Buy as big a outboard as you think you can handle getting on/off the dinghy alongside and can stow and is rated for the dinghy. 

    Bottom line, distilling all of the above, my recommendation for the 'perfect' dinghy/outboard  for the cruising WS32 would be a 9-10' lightweight (singlefloor) Hypalon RIB with an 8Hp 2 cycle Yamaha Enduro.  Both the outboard 7 dinghy (running about 75 & 90 lbs respectfully) are relatively easy to manhandle on/off the deck.

    At least that's my story and I'm sticking with it :)

    p.s. If/when you get to the Rio Dulce be sure to look me up
  • February 13, 2012 11:50 AM
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    Reply # 824223 on 819797
    Deleted user
    Thanks Mike  That's what's great about you guy's. Your experience with this boat and the advise you give is a huge help to me. I want to be able to outfit my boat properly for long distance cruising before I strike out, get to some remote location, and find out the hard way that I should have made better, more informed, decisions. When I get down there, I'll certainly look you up. My plan is use Rio Dulce as a base of operations for two or three years, then, head for the South Pacific. I'm in Afghanistan right now and have been for the past three years. I live in Thailand. My wife and I, she's Thai,own a restaurant on a beach road in the Gulf of Thailand. We'll sell the restaurant in about a year or so, but I'll start getting all this started and in place while she takes care of everything there. Then we'll jump. Thanks again.  Sam
  • February 16, 2012 10:39 AM
    Quote
    Reply # 827151 on 819797
    Anonymous member

    Mike's comment made me chuckle.  He said, " I see very few 'hard' (rowing/sailing) dinghies.  Those I do see are used by  the more ummm... down &amp; out cruisers or those that view rowing as an essential exercise regimen. "   


    Even though WOA members all cruise, we populate the full spectrum of budget universes.


    My Fatty Knees hard dinghy is 35 years old.  When it breaks I can repair it with epoxy and fiberglass.   It rows like a dream using 7.5 foot oars.  My wife is fond of touring the harbors on calm nights using only oars under the stars. Her rowing skills are so sharp many people ask if she was an Olympic rower.  When we are not rowing, at 2 HP outboard makes it go 6 knots.


    If I had inflatable dinghies and 15 HP motors for the past 35 years I would probably be on my 5th set of replacements of each, costing God knows how many thousands of dollars, and we might need an expensive land-based way to exercise.


    I guess I'm among the down and out crowd.  On the other hand, my pennies stretch to permit this life style.  Today is my 2545th consecutive day cruising on my W32 so I hardly feel deprived.
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