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Ice Box Liner Removal

  • September 05, 2011 9:04 AM
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    Reply # 692384 on 692323
    Anonymous member
    Werner Hamp wrote:

    P.S. Braden-Can you give me the details on the distributor in Jupiter? I'm only a couple hours "up the road" from there.


    Sure, as I understand it, the Jupiter location is their US HQ which also includes the warehouse distributer.

    There is a small lobby that has each of their products on display - they are not hooked up to power, but otherwise are available for a hands-on experience.

    This picture from their website is exactly what it looks like, we picked our unit up at one of the three dock bays on the left side:

    engel
  • September 06, 2011 6:58 AM
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    Reply # 692946 on 691898
    Deleted user
    When I rebuilt my boat I replaced the old dc cold plate system with the Engel Mt-45.  I have an opening lid that is nearly the full depth of the counter and the Engel is positioned just beneath the lid.  I have storage below which is accessed by a drop down door on the inboard side of the cabinet.  I also added 2 levels of storage outboard of the Engel accessed from above.  I found it necessary to add a louvered vent on each side of the cabinet to allow the unit to breathe.  We've been very happy with the unit since moving aboard and once cold it draws under 2 amps.
  • September 06, 2011 11:10 AM
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    Reply # 693152 on 691898
    Deleted user

    Braden, thank you for the info on Engel in Jupiter and thanks to you Tom for sharing your experience with the MT 45. I've decided to go with the MB 40 drop in unit. It looks as if the unit will leave quite a bit of space for a drawer or sliding basket underneath. I'm going to start this little project by removing the sea rail and inboard end of the cabinet and see what's what. I received a new digital camera from my son and will try to document all of the work from the beginning. I also want to try to keep my existing teak icebox lids and come up with a plan to make them integral with the lid on the MB 40.

    Werner
  • September 11, 2011 7:09 AM
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    Reply # 696676 on 691898
    Deleted user
    Werner,  If you get really ambitious and want to rebuild your icebox for refrigeration, I did that on Second Wind.  I had no liner (or anything inside the icebox except for the plain plywood outer box) and had to start from scratch.   I came up with a design with about an R24 insulating factor and just over 5 cu ft of space.   The plans are packed, but I could probably find them if you are interested.  in addition to the dual lift-off lids, the entire top of the icebox can be removed with six screws.   I did that so that I could add refrigeration at some future date without tearing things apart.   The inner liner is 1/2 inch plywood with a white formica layer to protect it and keep it clean, per Bud's suggestion.  It took a while to fabricate it, especially the stepped lids, and it's hardly lightweight, but it's plenty sturdy.   I also have a Fein if you need to use one - let me know asap before I pack for the trip to FL on the 20th.   -Tom Koehl
  • September 12, 2011 5:52 AM
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    Reply # 697189 on 691898
    Deleted user
    Hi Tom,

    Thanks for your kind offer. I'm probably going to go with the Engel MB 40 Drop-In unit pending a trip to down to Jupiter for a look-see of the unit. Go ahead and pack your stuff as I will not be starting the project until after your move down here. In fact, I want to wait until you're in the area so I can benefit from your expertise and advice. After seeing what you have done with Second Wind, you are truly the expert !! Jack Webb of Drifter is also moving to the area. I'm looking forward to getting out and doing some sailing with you guys until your boats are here and ready. It will be The Old Men and the Sea. I hope one of you has a video camera. I'll provide the beer and Depends.

    Werner
  • October 28, 2011 5:14 AM
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    Reply # 735967 on 691898
    Anonymous member
    The Engels are very popular here on the NW Caribbean. I have yet to hear a complaint about them.  I've only seen them used as a 'standalone' instead of installing them in any way.

    My 35 year old icebox insulation is shot making my Adler Barbour run excessively.  I've thought seriously about replacing the icebox with an Engel unit (instead of rebuilding/insulating the icebox) but two things have me stumped:

    1. I have yet to figure out how to 'install' the Engel so it is flush mounted with the cabinet top and still be able to fully open the lid (I have the overhead cabinetry as well).

    2. The Engel operates as either a freezer OR a refrigerator, not both.  I hate losing the freezer of the Adler Barbour even though it is tiny.  I've even considered how I might install dual Engels, one small for a freezer and a larger one for a reefer but there just isn't enough room (not to mention it gets pricey).

    So I guess I'm back to rebuilding my original icebox. 

    @ Braden - I'm curious, from your pics it looks like you were able to remove your old icebox without disassembling the surrounding wood.  Or did you have to remove the 'front' (inboard) panel as per your last pic?
  • October 28, 2011 9:41 AM
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    Reply # 736165 on 691898
    Anonymous member
    Throw a few cents in about our experience with the ice beast.

    We were going to take our liner out as it had been mangled by one of the previous owners, but we eventually decided against it due to the amount of dismantling it would have taken; it would have been too much at that time, especially with the other projects we were trying to tackle.

    Instead, we were able to gouge out pretty much all of the old pour-in insulation through the many holes that had been cut by the POs, and via the gap at the top between the liner/outside plywood. Then we replaced it with more pour-in insulation, put in from about 40 different points, so I think we got all of the gaps. We also totally redesigned the top/lids and insulated the underpart of the counter, which is probably where 90% of the leakage was anyway.

    Our "controlled" test of improvement was done with a single 10lb block of ice with nothing else; before, it lasted about 24 hours, after, about 4 days. In terms of the icebox in use, we've had a couple seven day trips during which we made several 10lb blocks, precooled all the food, and by the end of the trip, there was still about a pound of ice left in the slush (along with some nice, cold beer!) A big key here is NOT draining the box; let the water stand at the bottom and keep all the food that can't be wet above it on a shelf.

    Here are some photos of our galley makeover

    Happy sailing!
    Aaron
  • October 29, 2011 10:18 AM
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    Reply # 737058 on 691898
    Deleted user

    Mike, on the Engel's site they show a dual freezer/fridge unit.  Cost a lot but looks good. Ken
  • February 05, 2012 10:07 PM
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    Reply # 816860 on 691898
    Anonymous
    I noticed the current youtube video on the site had an Engel tucked away in the galley and it got me thinking about this thread. 

    Anyone care to share photos or further progress reports of Engel installs? 
  • February 06, 2012 6:56 AM
    Quote
    Reply # 817017 on 691898
    Deleted user

    Hi Tate,

    I have just finished installation of the Isotherm Compact Classic Model 2001 in the existing icebox which has the factory standard liner. After considering and nearly purchasing the Engel drop in unit, I opted for this installation instead for a number of reasons.

    The unit was highly reccommended to me by a long term live-aboard at the marina.

    No destruction or removal of the liner was required.

    The size of the refrigerated area with the Compact unit is some 3 cu. ft. greater than the Engel.

    No modification to the existing ice box lids was required.

    I had a lexan evaporater mount left over from the old AB Cold Machine, never operational and removed in 2000, already on hand.

    I caught the unit on sale for $ 830.00.

    The installation, while presenting some difficulties for one person, was fairly straightforward. In order to not over burden the unit I reduced the existing ice box capacity from some 7+ cu. ft. to about 4 cu. ft. by installing an insulated "bulkhead" and then added and improved aditional insulation to the box similar to what Aaron Norlund described in an earlier post on this thread.

    The unit has been keeping the box at about 40 degrees F and draws about 2 amps when it runs. I have the thermostat set at halfway between OFF and the maximum setting. This is with an average temperature of about 75 degrees F over the last two weeks, which is how long the unit has been operating. I have noticed some condensation forming behind the setee cushion and it looks as if some more insulation work needs to be done. I also plan to run some tests with a "DOC WATTSON" amp hour gauge when all the insulation work is done. In the meantime, it looks like a good decision. Some project pictures are posted at

    https://picasaweb.google.com/108129568963111142806

    and I will add more as I finish up.

    The evaporator unit will also make ice, albeit in a very small tray, which has all but eliminated my trips to the ice house every other day.

    Hope this helps.

    Werner

     

    Last modified: February 06, 2012 2:59 PM | Deleted user
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