Planning a Haul-Out - Doing too much in too little time!

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  • April 15, 2011 6:25 PM
    Message # 571641
    Hello all,

    The purpose of this thread is to help new owners make decisions concerning, plan for, and execute, owner-completed short-term yet high-yield, haul-out of their boat. It is not meant to be a "how-to" or definitive guide, but more so a musing and checklist of how I plan to juggle completing too many projects in too little time with too little help!

    Our boat is located in SW Florida and is kept in the water (and sailed) year round. Short-term hauling incurs daily yard fees and is, in general, quite expensive, thus it is best to complete work in as short of period as possible.

    I would appreciate comments from others concerning their own methods of preparing and completing this universal-maintenance, as well as from those with questions. Suggestions to my requests for advice are greatly appreciated, too!




    We're planning to haul our W32 for the first time since we acquired her a few years ago. Yes, I know, we should be ashamed! But, in our defense, we've kept the zincs fresh, and the bottom has only recently started to develop growth. We've been able to keep the hull slime, barnacle, and weed free with a bi-yearly scrub; but she has a copperclad bottom with four coats of some form of antifouling paint, so it has been nice.

    Anyway, we're planning a five-day haul, during which my sister and I aim to accomplish the following rotund list:

    • Remove two seacocks, plus an old depth transducer, and fill their holes with vinylester FRP patches.
    • Barriercoat the rudder: I've observed small pin-size blisters on the rudder (but ONLY the rudder), so I plan to strip the paint off of it below the waterline and coat with a Interlux 2000e epoxy barrier coat. This barrier coat requires very specific intervals between coats.
    • New Anti-fouling on the bottom: Assuming the hull is happily blister and problem free, (and I believe it is as I spent two hours under in clear water with SCUBA gear going over the whole hull my hands and a scotchbright pad, looking for blistering issues and anything else that might cause a longer haul time...none found), we'll sand the boat and apply new bottom paint.
    • Prime and paint the topsides: I plan to use either 100% Acrylic Latex Exterior, or Glidden Porch & Floor Polyurethane Oil Gloss (more on this below).
    • Varnish bottom of bowsprit (this is quite easy to do from the dinghy, but we'll have the supplies out, anyway.)
    • Reinstall the MaxProp (several months after buying the boat, the old bronze prop shaft sheared off from the terrible electrical situation the boat was left in by the previous owner. Luckily we were running the boat in the slip, adjusting the shift cable, so we were able to recover the prop). I was able to replace the prop shaft and cutlass bearing with the boat in the water, but the maxprop has too many small parts to fumble with in the water, so we put the old fixed blade on.
    • Replace zincs
    • Add line-preventer to gap on bottom of keel between keel/rudder.

    Practically speaking, I have three options for painting the bottom; I would appreciate opinions on this matter. Clearly we're not in a particularly high-fouling area, which has allowed our long haul lapse. I realize this is a fairly personal subject, but everyone's situation is different, so I don't think there can be enough dialogue concerning the matter. I'm considering using three methods:
    1. All ablative; I can get West Marine CPP Plus Ablative paint for $48/gal (normally $120). If I choose all ablative, I'm thinking of applying 3 coats, plus a fourth to high-drag areas. I would make the first coat a different color from the second two (Red, then black, likely). This should be doable with six gallons (~$300).
    2. All hard (modified epoxy): This would be more expensive, but I could apply three coats of Unepoxy, which I can get for $100/gal (5 gals, $500)
    3. Hard base, ablative top: This seems like a good mix; apply two coats of Unepoxy for a durable, contact-leeching backup, then two coats of a different color ablative on top of that, with perhaps a third coat on the leading edges. (3x$100, 3x$50 = $450). The advantage I see to this method is that, if sometime rubs agains the ablative paint, it can almost literally "wipe it off". In this case, the hard would take over. Also, once the ablative wore through to the hard paint, we would still have some anti-fouling power left in the hull until we have time to haul. 
    4. Due to cost, I am only able to consider the paints listed above. $200/gal is not within our budget.
    5. Thoughts? Other options?


    As for the topside paint, I do have rational.
    1. I have seen three boats painted with 100% acrylic latex paint and they looked fabulous. The paint, if thinned a smidgen, then rolled and tipped like any other, will level and leave a beautiful finish, quite on par with Awlgrip (believe it or not).
    2. It is long-lasting when compared to some marine paints I've seen, and that makes sense; these paints have received exponentially more research than marine paints, driven by an exponentially larger market, which has allowed their development into very formidable coatings. Great gloss retention in high UV exposure, virtually no color fading (this is one of the important things to building painters; they want to be able to touch up three years later without a new paint formula).
    3. The coatings are quite durable, while being easy to repair; just sand and recoat, feathering the edges.
    4. Easy preparation; no buying five surface-preparing solvents, special thinners, etc. Of course, the surface has to be as fair as with any other coating if it's to look good.
    5. Very affordable by any measure, especially marine! The highest quality 100% acrylic paint is about $25/gal, and can be mixed in any color. Coverage is good, prep is the same as with any paint; a single coat of latex primer binds the topcoat to the surface. I anticipate this will require 1 gallon of primer, 2 gallons of topcoat, for a whopping total of about $90, including roller covers, brushes, tape, and beer. That is less than the cost of the solvents used for Awlgrip and other 2-part paints. 
    6. Easy cleanup; waterbased paint.
    7. I am also considering using Glidden's Porch & Floor Polyurethane Oil Gloss, the paint we used for our non-skid on deck. It has held up very well, showing no chalking, loss of color, adhesion, etc, in a year and half of southern Florida UV.



    Planned schedule to accomplish all of this with two bodies (Asia and Aaron) and five days of Florida heat:


    Days before - Get ready, gather materials and scout out
    • Determine whether paints/materials must be purchased from yard's store. If so, verify they have your chosen product in stock (make sure they have your colors, and MORE than needed, if possible. It takes one mistake to mess up timing!)
    • What are yard rules - Do I need a vacuum sander, and if so, what type (100% industrial or joe's rig-it-yourself vac sander...#2 is our answer). Do I need to visqueen the boat for sanding; if so, are there open days that do not require it?
    • If I can buy materials elsewhere (I can), get them stocked up before hand. Bottom paint, topside paints, fillers, rollers, tape, tape, tape, tape, more tape, and stuff. Find a place that will shake your bottom paint the day before you need to apply it, or have a drill stirrer with you.
    • Stop by the yard to say "hi" and confirm your arrangements. Be nice and they may let you look around the yard; See if there is a place where a tree or boat awning may cast the your boat in shade at some point of the day; see if they can arrange to put your boat there.
    • Scout out if there is anything special you should bring. i.e., plastic chairs or something to sit on, yards are sometimes devoid of seats, a sheet of plywood for work table, shade umbrella if there isn't a rest area, trash can, etc.

    Day Before - Get there
    • Sail boat to yard. In our case, we have about 25mi total travel, and have to time arriving at a lock at high tide.
    • "Confirm" with yard (aka, remind them) we'll be ready to haul in the AM.
    • Ask about your shady spot.
    • Make sure there is a place to anchor, moor, or dock near or at the yard
    • Many yards will, if you are the first haul of the next morning, haul your boat the evening before and leave it in the slings overnight, or let you dock up in the hauling slip.

    Day 1

    • Haul scheduled at 7 AM, so the workers will show up and be ready at 7:40; pressure wash to remove as much old ablative as possible to minimize sanding dust. The hull is pretty darn clean now.
    • Bring ice chest with water and gatorade for the yard workers; often more appreciated than a tip, especially if you tell them they can come back for more later after it's hot (which is a good time to ask them when they can help reposition stands...this is a good time to invite them back after work for a beer; a great way for them to remain helpful and forgiving of you, a DIY dork, putzing along in their yard).
    • Make sure space is left under keel to install line-keeper on keel.
    • Blocked up and tarped by about 9:00am.
    • Ensure prop nut will come lose; apply PB Blaster if necessary.
    • Inspect pintals/gudeons and riding bushings.
    • Inspect packing gland to determine if replacement is necessary (do early so you can get it!)
    • Have the beer iced by the end of the day for your yard helpers. Buy good beer.
    Aaron:
    • Remove two seacocks and old transducer.
    • Once holes are open in the hull, get them ground back and prepared for glasswork (To be completed following day). Soak ground glass with denatured alcohol to help purge moisture. Pattern, cut out, and prepare fiberglass sandwich patches. Lay out materials for next day.
    Asia: Boot stripe, Rudder prep, service seacocks
    • Sand and fair bootstripe and area above/below, tape off.
    • Coat of bootstripe paint
    • Strip the rudder to gelcoat or glass below the waterline in prep for barrier coat.
    • Tape off rudder so it's ready to receive coating immediately in morning.
    • Disassemble, inspect seacocks and grease (do this early in case I need parts.)
    • 2nd coat of bootstripe paint, remove tape

    This will likely take the majority of the working day; if time is available, remove decals/hull lettering from topsides and apply a round of body filler to imperfections.


    Day 2

    Asia: Rudder barrier coating, topside prep, prime
    • Once applied, Interlux 2000e (at the temp we're working in) must be recoated between the 2nd and 3rd hour. After mixing the paint, there is a 20 minute  "standing" or "setup" period. The standing time and time between coating rudder can be spent prepping topsides; applying filler and sanding overall.
    • I want 4 coats on the rudder, so it'll take all day with the necessary cure times. 
    • Plan to put one coat of bottom paint on right before leaving, but 2 hours after last coat of 2000e (you MUST put the bottom paint on within three hours!)
    • Tape off bootstripe with low-grip green tape, with scuff-resistant tape on top.
    • The topsides are in pretty good condition, I expect it to take roughly four hours to apply fillers and get the hull sanded and prepared; to be done between rudder coatings
    • While sanding topsides, lightly sand bottom of bowsprit for fresh varnish.
    • Scrub topsides/bowsprit with brush and rinse to remove sanding dust.
    • Prime with Glidden Gripper white, slightly thinned, roll and tip with Aaron.
    Aaron: fiberglass patches and gelcoating, bottom prep, prime topsides
    • Mix vinylester, coat glass to be patched; let setup to tack stage. Wet out and apply patches on inside, then apply patches to outside, taping in place. Leave to cure, then fill with underwater putty, let cure, apply vinylester gelcoat, leave to cure, sand down. Cure times of the vinylester should allow the patching, including gelcoating and finish sanding, to be completed by mid-day.
    • Have Asia apply two coats of the rudder's Interprotect 2000e to patches while doing rudder.
    • Bottom paint prep: Tape off waterline and course-sand hull, especially high-drag areas.
    • Wire brush/clean pintals/gudeons.
    • Wire brush/clean engine intake (interior/exterior)
    • When ready, help Asia with rolling and tipping primer
    • Coat of bottom paint on 2000e and high-drag areas right before leaving, or full coat if time.

    Day 3

    Asia: sand/fair primer, washdown and first topcoat
    • Sand/fair topside primer with 180
    • Remove tape from bootstripe
    • Vacuum and Wash down hull
    • Coat of varnish on bottom of bowsprit while waiting for hull to dry
    • Replace Bottom and topside tape on bootstripe.
    • 1st coat of topside paint with Aaron, roll and tip
    • 1st coat of bottom paint
    • Lightly sand bottom of bowsprit for another coat before leaving
    Aaron: Topside paint, hardware
    • Help with topside paint when needed
    • Install keel's line-keeper
    • Remove fixed prop
    • Remove/replace cutlass bearing and packing if necessary
    • Install maxprop

    Day 4


    Asia and Aaron: Bottom and topsides
    • Lightly sand topsides
    • Aaron applies 2nd coat of bottom paint
    • Remove boot tape and vacuum/washdown
    • Coat of varnish on bowsprit while waiting for hull to dry
    • New bootstripe tape
    • Roll/tip 2nd coat of topcoat
    • Third coat of bottom paint
    • Remove bootstripe paint
    • Hull-lettering artist to paint name/port in late afternoon after topside paint has setup.
    • Lightly sand bottom of bowsprit for 3rd coat of varnish

    Day 5

    Asia: Any remaining coating needs
    • 3rd coat of varnish on bowsprit
    • Address any topside paint issues
    • Use remaining antifouling paint for 4th coat or additional on high-drag areas.
    Aaron: Any remaining mechanical needs
    • Flush engine with salt-flush (to remove calcium and residue buildup in radiator)
    • Replace engine zincs
    • Replace cranse iron zinc
    Launch in the late evening, give the yard workers some more beer and they'll let you stay on a dock overnight. It's late in the week at this point, Friday night, so they'll be especially happy for a good cold beer from a couple of folks who accomplished a ton of work, all while being clean, courteous, and professional.



    By planning a logical schedule, based on coating cure times and realistic expectations, we have been able to have several high-output, short-period haul-outs with previous boats. Will everything progress exactly as planned? Of course not! But by having a good plan, we have a better chance of accomplishing what we need to in an affordable amount of time.

    Love, luck and sweet coconuts to you all!
    Aaron N.

  • April 15, 2011 8:31 PM
    Reply # 571701 on 571641
    Anonymous member (Administrator)

    Aaron:

    Reading your list makes me tired!  Hope you and Asia survive the event.

    My thoughts are to only do the work where the boat has to be out of the water and leave the deck work for your slip. 

    I'm required to use a wet air sander when roughing up the bottom paint here in Svendsens'.  That is enough to keep the bottom paint out of the water.

    Removing the thru hulls fast - I've found that a right angle metal grinder and grinding three grooves in the exterior head - allows you to cold chiesel off the three pieces and freeing the assembly.  The same metal cutting grinder wheel will quickly prep the area for the hull patch.

    Wish you had a web cam on the project!!

    Stay safe

    Jay

    Last modified: April 15, 2011 8:31 PM | Anonymous member (Administrator)
  • April 16, 2011 2:13 AM
    Reply # 571872 on 571641
    Deleted user
    Aaron,

    Very ambitious schedule. I've managed to do just topsides and anti-fouling in a week, but I've worked solo...

    I'll be interested to find out more about your line-preventer installation, materials used and pics would be nice. I'm planning to make one during my next hail-out and am thinking of bolting in sail pieces batten on both sides of the keel...

    Good luck with your work!
    Wojciech
    s/v Namaste
  • April 16, 2011 10:29 AM
    Reply # 571974 on 571701
    Jay Bietz wrote:

    My thoughts are to only do the work where the boat has to be out of the water and leave the deck work for your slip. 

    It occurred to me that I hadn't defined "topsides" - that's to mean the exterior hull above the waterline. In some places what I call the "deck" and "cabin trunk" is referred to as topsides. I suppose we could paint the upper hull while the boat is in the water, but I think it would be tedious, and I'd be concerned with containing sanding dust and keeping it out of the water.

    Yes, this is an ambitious schedule, but having worked in a yard for a short while, as well as on a couple tall ships during their VERY ambitious yard periods, I learned that by setting up a schedule based on cure times and planning the use of time between coatings, then slave driving some, a remarkable amount can be accomplished. Much hinges on being able to remove the through-hulls quickly, but that should be doable by cutting them out.

    It also helps that we're both in our twenties, as my father (who recently broke his wrist...dropping our "team" from three to two!) pointed out. :)


    Wojciech,

    I like your idea about the fiberglass batten. I was planning to use a piece of 1/8" stainless I have left over from another project, but an inert material sounds like a better alternative. I had planned to use a 90* drill to set a couple screws in the bottom of the keel, but with a fiberglass strip, could glue it on with thickened epoxy.

    ~A
    Last modified: April 16, 2011 10:29 AM | Anonymous member
  • April 16, 2011 1:36 PM
    Reply # 572030 on 571641
    Anonymous
    Aaron Norlund wrote:
    1. I have seen three boats painted with 100% acrylic latex paint and they looked fabulous. The paint, if thinned a smidgen, then rolled and tipped like any other, will level and leave a beautiful finish, quite on par with Awlgrip (believe it or not).
    2. It is long-lasting when compared to some marine paints I've seen, and that makes sense; these paints have received exponentially more research than marine paints, driven by an exponentially larger market, which has allowed their development into very formidable coatings. Great gloss retention in high UV exposure, virtually no color fading (this is one of the important things to building painters; they want to be able to touch up three years later without a new paint formula).
    3. The coatings are quite durable, while being easy to repair; just sand and recoat, feathering the edges.
    4. Easy preparation; no buying five surface-preparing solvents, special thinners, etc. Of course, the surface has to be as fair as with any other coating if it's to look good.
    5. Very affordable by any measure, especially marine! The highest quality 100% acrylic paint is about $25/gal, and can be mixed in any color. Coverage is good, prep is the same as with any paint; a single coat of latex primer binds the topcoat to the surface. I anticipate this will require 1 gallon of primer, 2 gallons of topcoat, for a whopping total of about $90, including roller covers, brushes, tape, and beer. That is less than the cost of the solvents used for Awlgrip and other 2-part paints. 
    6. Easy cleanup; waterbased paint.
    7. I am also considering using Glidden's Porch & Floor Polyurethane Oil Gloss, the paint we used for our non-skid on deck. It has held up very well, showing no chalking, loss of color, adhesion, etc, in a year and half of southern Florida UV

    Finally, a subject that I know a little about. I once painted a work van with an exterior, acrylic latex house paint and it held up beautifully! I agree that it could be a viable option for your boat. The only problem is that when sanding latex you will not be able to get it to feather down to an invisible edge, so if you have a ding or scrape it will show when repainted. If i were you I'd go with the oil based product because it will sand down nicely. Also, I'd use a slow drying alkyd primer (not kills or parks primer sealer!). The fast drying primers will leave you with a huge cracking mess. If your painting your topsides a dark color use a grey primer or have the paint shop tint it. It may save you having to do an extra coat. Good luck.
  • April 16, 2011 4:37 PM
    Reply # 572099 on 571641
    Eric,

    Thanks for the input about the paint. I hadn't considered that it wouldn't feather down well; why is it that? As for fast vs. slow dry primer, can you suggest a specific product? I haven't seen a difference in the labeling of fast/slow.

    One of my concerns with the oil paint is that it needs pretty much a whole day between coats. I'm not sure what color we're going to go with; I had assumed a white, but my sister has proposed we reevaluate the hull/whalestrip colors entirely.



    Norm or anyone,

    What is the square footage of the rudder? More specifically, if you know, the below-water portion? I'm trying to determine if I should get two quarts of 2000e, or a gallon. One gallon provides about 60 ft2 when brushing (five coats), so I'm betting I'll need a whole gallon.



    On another note, we've been looking at our schedule a bit more and I think we're going to have to split up our work week with a three day gap, having the boat out for a total of seven days. So, especially if we go with the oil-based paint, we may rearrange and get the topsides primed and the first topcoat on before the gap, then it'll be nicely cured and ready for sanding and a second when we return.

    Cheers,
    Aaron
  • April 16, 2011 5:58 PM
    Reply # 572121 on 571974
    Anonymous
    Aaron Norlund wrote:

    Yes, this is an ambitious schedule, but having worked in a yard for a short while, as well as on a couple tall ships during their VERY ambitious yard periods, I learned that by setting up a schedule based on cure times and planning the use of time between coatings, then slave driving some, a remarkable amount can be accomplished. Much hinges on being able to remove the through-hulls quickly, but that should be doable by cutting them out.

    In Norway we have a saying: “Good preparation is half the job”.

    You`ll make it, you are half the way already!

    Ole.

  • April 17, 2011 6:36 AM
    Reply # 572253 on 571641
    Deleted user

    Hi Aaron,

    I have aquestion on your post quoted here.

    1. I am also considering using Glidden's Porch & Floor Polyurethane Oil Gloss, the paint we used for our non-skid on deck. It has held up very well, showing no chalking, loss of color, adhesion, etc, in a year and half of southern Florida UV

    I have prepped my foredeck for new non-skid with the intent of experimenting with some different options. Since you seem to have found an inexpensive and viable solution and not having a need to re-invent the wheel, so to speak, maybe you can offer some advice.

    Did you use a non-skid additive such as silica in the paint or did you use a texture roller to create a non-skid surface?

    Any info would be greatly appreciated.

    Best Regards,

    Werner 

     

  • April 17, 2011 8:56 PM
    Reply # 572614 on 572253
    Werner Hamp wrote:

    Did you use a non-skid additive such as silica in the paint or did you use a texture roller to create a non-skid surface?

     

    Hi Werner,

    We used the non-skid additive that was available at Home Depot by Behr. We doubled their suggested amount; two packets per gallon. The deck is pretty nice to work on now, although I generally am barefooted or wearing deck boots or shoes; a couple folks who've come on board thought it was slippery in their land-shoes.

    I didn't use a textured roller for two reasons. 1) They leave the coating VERY thick in some areas, and I think the paint would have to be designed to cure in that thickness. 2) This leaves an extremely grippy surface; we used KiwiGrip for our cockpit sole, utilizing a textured roller. It's kinda uncomfortably grippy, and painful to kneel on.

    Would our deck be adequately non-skid for a commercial boat? No. But for us, it's a good balance between comfort and grip.

    ~Aaron
  • April 18, 2011 3:21 AM
    Reply # 572689 on 571641
    Deleted user

    Aaron,

    Thanks for the information. I was leaning toward Kiwi Grip but will follow in your footsteps on this project. Keep those pictures coming of Asia Marie. Your projects and upgrades are great. I love outside the envelope solutions and innovations especially when the dreaded trip to the local W*** Marine can be avoided. I am experimenting fairly succesfully with a standard room air conditioner at the moment It is set completely internally on the hanging locker shelf opposite the head with a $ 98.00 5000 btu unit from Home Depot and using a standard bathroom vent fan to exhaust the discharge which draws its cooling air from behind the furniture and lockers. Total cost thus far, about $ 120.00. I will post this project in the near future if anyone is interested. The "Norlund Pilot Berth Conversion" is now rapidly moving toward the top of my projects list.

    Maybe a forum on projects like this can be added to the new site, which in my opinion is by far the best owners web site on the net. You guys are doing a fantastic job.

    Thanks again Aaron.

    Werner 

    Last modified: April 18, 2011 3:21 AM | Deleted user
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