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Older Groco Head Installation

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  • May 21, 2013 8:52 AM
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    Message # 1297979
    Deleted user
    When I did the restoration on Second Wind (W32) I installed the original Groco head (after rebuilding it with new seals, etc) as well as the poly holding tank under the port V-berth, with both overboard discharge and holding tank plumbing per Bud's manual.   However, when I put the boat in the water I found that I couldn't get a suction on the feed water line.  I called Groco and they told me that the head wouldn't work with a vacuum break loop and I had to run a direct line to the water intake seacock.   I replumbed it and it works, however I'm scared to have just one lousy clamp on the head between me and the sea floor, so I installed a separate shut-off valve on the feed line and have yet to use the head, much to the dismay of my wife and her female friends.   

    Am I being overly apprehensive (if there is such a thing), or is there a simple solution I'm overlooking?  Do I need to change heads?   I always thought a loop with a siphon break was mandatory on any water intake line.   After seven years of restoration I sure don't want to come back to the marina and find the boat on the bottom!  - Tom  
  • May 21, 2013 9:37 AM
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    Reply # 1298048 on 1297979
    Anonymous member

    Tom,

              The head installation you mention is normal. The user must be instructed to open the feed water seacock when flushing and closing it after use, a bit of a pain but the only way to eliminate worries. I have a Raritan head valved that way and I am switching to a Lavac head this summer. It uses a feed water loop above the waterline with a small air bleed to break the siphon. All sea cocks are closed when leaving the boat but no need to open and close it each time it is used. I will eliminate the feed water seacock and plumb the feed line off of the head sink drain. One less hole to worry about.         Lee
  • May 21, 2013 3:55 PM
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    Reply # 1298443 on 1297979
    Deleted user
    Just a point on the wall.

    I have the same unit but installed the with the anti siphon on the suction line.  OK it wont work?  well as I use tape for varnish I always have a roll around,  so when I flush I put a bit of tape over the hole on the anti siphon, and then pump ( works  fine, if it is not to high up) then when I am done, I peel it back. Option #2 is to use your finger.  One pc tape works 2 to 10 times depending.   I know, not elegant, but works for me. You just need to have the dutch crew (finger in the dyke)  ar ar.  In any case, the tape or finger works and will allow protection when not active.

    Hope this helps out.
    Norm

    Option C:  a direction which I may go to?? is to use fresh water for the flush, no sea water inlet needed but (it is a crappy use of the valuable fresh water but has the potential to be a sweeter smelling boat?). 

     
    Last modified: May 21, 2013 3:58 PM | Deleted user
  • May 22, 2013 7:54 AM
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    Reply # 1298903 on 1297979
    Deleted user
    Thanks, guys.  I was afraid that I was going nuts and had a one-of-a-kind installation.   I thought about the fresh water option, but have a hard time reconciling that on the east coast.  Perhaps if I was still on the Great Lakes . . .

    I'll just have to go with the way I have it installed, i.e., with the in-line valve.   The nipple on the feed water intake of the head is just not very long and I can only get one clamp on it, plus I have visions of the head overflowing and sinking the boat.   I'll have to get a placard made up instructing users in the proper operation.   It's about as bad as a head on a submarine!

    Tom
  • May 23, 2013 8:20 AM
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    Reply # 1299863 on 1297979
    Anonymous member
    Not to hijack the topic but I'm just wondering...

    I have the original Wilcox-Crittenden Head Mate toilet.  It's working fine but I know at some point I'll probably have to replace it.

    Does anyone know of a 'drop in' replacement?  A head that would not require extensive re-plumbing (or ideally, none)?
  • May 24, 2013 5:49 AM
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    Reply # 1300533 on 1297979
    Deleted user
    Parts are still available to rebuild the Wilcox Crittenden head.  If you are concerned about availability in the future, you might want to accumulate some spares for overhauls.  You will spend quite a bit of $$$ to replace your head with one of the same quality.  They are quite rugged.
  • May 24, 2013 8:27 AM
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    Reply # 1300664 on 1298048
    Anonymous member (Administrator)
    Lee Perry wrote:

    ...I will eliminate the feed water seacock and plumb the feed line off of the head sink drain.


    Lee: I'm trying to visualize the above -- so the fresh water feed to the head is from the head sink - do you fill the sink when you flush the head? 

    I'm hoping to have a holding tank in Pygmalion (beyond the 6 gallon portapotty) soon - thinking ahead that fresh water flush would be nice.

    Jay
  • May 24, 2013 7:03 PM
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    Reply # 1301047 on 1297979
    Anonymous member

    Jay,

           The head sink seacock is about two feet below waterline so there is always standing water in the drainline. I will tee off the drainline just above the seacock for the head.  No freshwater just seawater.   Lee

    Last modified: May 24, 2013 7:04 PM | Anonymous member
  • May 25, 2013 5:53 AM
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    Reply # 1301224 on 1297979
    Deleted user
    Jay & Lee

    Several yard periods ago I plugged most of the thru-hulls on TAMZIN leaving only the engine and head intakes and overboard discharge from the slop tank.  I put a tee inline from the head intake and connected the sink drain.  So now, when at the dock, you leave the sea-cock closed fill the sink and then flush.  This works great, all of the nasty noxious  smell that used to accumulate in the head is gone and I've had absolutely no problems with the arrangement. The only thing better would be an Air-head which is on the list but not any time soon.
  • May 25, 2013 6:47 AM
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    Reply # 1301245 on 1297979
    Anonymous member
    Larry,

    Groco is right about not having a siphon breaker on the inlet line.  What I recommend is to install a quarter turn ball valve on the inlet line right next to the head.  It is left shut off except when you actually want to pump water through the head.  But you do have to remember to shut it off after pumping.  A large sign in front of the eyes should do the trick.

    Bud
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